Tales from A Rebranding Experience with Virginia Beer Co.

Episode Overview

We've got a story for you. It starts with a couple of buddies who met in college, graduated, and then decided to start a brewery together. Since then, they have grown the brewery to be quite a staple in their community.

In fact, their beer is served around the world, including in Virginia. New York, the United Kingdom, Europe, Asia, and even New Zealand. So what started out as just a couple of buddies in college has grown into something quite amazing. We're talking about the Virginia Beer Co and were joined by founders Chris Smith and Robby Willey on the latest Get Hoptimized Podcast.

We could have them on just because they've grown a successful brewery, but they've recently gone through a rebranding which we thought was especially fascinating. So, dive into this episode to hear about why they decided to update the brand and what their experience was like along the way.

Learn more about Virginia Beer Co at virginiabeerco.com

Episode Transcript

(AI-Generated, please forgive any typos)

[00:00:00] Chris: What is up? This is the get optimized podcast and I am your host, Chris overlay, and this is a show all about craft beer. marketing and growth. Now, today I've got a story for you. It starts with a couple of buddies who met in college, graduated college, and then decided later on that they would start a brewery together and since then have grown this brewery to be quite a staple in their community.

In fact, their beer is served around the world including Virginia. New York, United Kingdom, Europe, Asia, and even New Zealand. So what started out as just a couple of buddies in college has grown to something quite amazing. I'm talking about the Virginia Beer Co.

Now, the reason they're here is we could just have 'em on because they've, they've grown a successful brew, and you could ask them all que all sorts of questions about that. But they've recently gone through a rebranding. And I thought that was very fascinating and I wanted to ask them a bunch of questions about what that was like, what decisions led to that, how the process went.

Because I think that there are many businesses out there, many of you that listen to this podcast or maybe considering going through that process or maybe doing a branding project for the first time. Well, this is a great couple of dudes to ask some questions of and uh, it was a great interview all together.

So I will get out of the way here. Thanks for tuning in. And by the way, if you find this episode helpful, educational, fun, insightful. Any of those foals, please share it with someone you think would get some value from it too. But for now, we'll get into the interview. Thanks. All right. We're here. What is up?

We have Chris and Robbie on the show here from Virginia Beer Co. How are you guys doing?

[00:02:09] Robby: Excellent. Good morning.

[00:02:11] Chris: Morning. Yes. Good morning. Yeah. You guys are coming up and during the recording here, you guys are in the middle of the smoke stuff up there. We were just talking about that before we jumped on.

You're surviving, I hope. Yeah, it's not too

[00:02:23] Chris Smith: bad here. We have it a little better than some of our neighbors to the North, but unusual certainly for the East coast. And, uh, I do think actually affecting business in a negative way this week.

[00:02:33] Chris: Yeah. It's the people don't want to go out and hang out in the smoky air.

Unfortunately. Um, maybe some inspiration though, you know, some like, you know, a smoke. smoke beer or something on the label or can or something like that from this

[00:02:46] Robby: time. Yeah, we, we did see some breweries joking that you walk outside and it smells like a Roush beer brew day. So, uh, you know, there's certainly, or maybe barrel aging with some mesquite chips.

So I think everyone's trying to, uh, take it in stride because obviously we don't have it as bad as our neighbors to the north. So we're, we're just, uh, keeping the doors closed and the taps open and hoping for the best. Drink away

[00:03:07] Chris: the sorrows of it. You know, that's that's my philosophy. Well, um, all right, guys.

Well, let's start with with who you are. You know, let's get a little background on who we're talking to. I don't know who wants to go first, but tell us about who you are to the brewery. You know, maybe a little bit of background of how you got into this space. And then we'll kind of roll into some fun stuff about, uh, the beer company and the brand and all that stuff.

Let's start

[00:03:30] Robby: with with you guys. Yeah, so we are a now seven year old microbrewery out of Williamsburg, Virginia, Southeast Virginia. Chris and I first met at university here at the local college William and Mary. Chris's wife is also an alum. And so, you know, the first part of the story starts with, you know, two guys who transferred to.

William Mary kind of a chance meeting, uh, staying close friends afterwards. I was the best man in Chris and Erin's wedding. Uh, and, and one thing that drew us, drew us together was our passion for William Mary. So we, we really, uh, loved where we went to school. We were so glad we ended up here. And so we started coming back as alums for volunteer work, uh, to help the college every quarter.

We joined different boards and, and that led us into the Williamsburg lifestyle as alums. Um, I think way more than, than most folks get a chance to enjoy. After they graduate. And, um, you know, we found ourselves visiting our old college stomping grounds while we were in town, and especially a specific craft beer ball, beer bar called the Greenleaf.

And the Greenleaf was one of the first craft beer bars back in that early two thousands age that, that had, uh, they, they, they had 40 taps, which was unheard of. Right? So beyond the macro beers that you found at every college bar, uh, they had all of these super interesting small batch beers from all over the country and all over the world.

And it really opened our eyes and our palates to what what craft beer and the brewing industry had to offer. So we fell in love with Williamsburg. We fell in love with craft beer. We started homebrewing and our personal lives. So I was in the D. C. area. Chris was in New York and then Boston. Whenever we visit one another, not in Williamsburg, we hurry to the nearest craft beer bar.

We'd hurry to the nearest brewery, hang out in tap rooms and 1 thing led to another. And we just not just love of the liquid, but also. The atmosphere of the industry, right? Because we, we would be hanging out at a brewery and people from brewery A would be hanging out with people from brewery B and brewery C would be tapping, tapping a collaboration involving brewery A and brewery B, and all those beers and all those people would be supporting all these local causes that were, that they were passionate about and people were enjoying themselves in these atmospheres and, and we didn't have that same level of comradery or.

Feeling like we were doing something impactful for the world in our respective industries and finance. And so it was just this combination of things as we grew as alums and in our, in our adult lives. You know, we loved craft beer. We loved teaming up and doing things together. We loved Williamsburg and we loved.

The positive atmosphere that we were seeing in the craft beer industry and craft beer bars and festivals and breweries and one thing led to another and it led us to the idea that, hey, well, if we love Williamsburg and we love teaming up and we love craft beer and we love doing good in the community, why not try to try to do it ourselves and make it make it a career.

And so, um, 2012, Chris and Aaron made their way back to Williamsburg and 2014. I was here full time. And finally, by 2016, we had doors and taps to open and it was called the Virginia Beer Company. Bye. Bye. Wow.

[00:06:15] Chris: Wow. A true story of college buddies making it, you know, and not straight out of college, you know, I had a startup when I was in college and we did that for a couple of years after we were done.

But you guys have kind of come back around and said. Hey, let's do this thing turned a passion project kind of, uh, you know, the homebrew truly the homebrewer to brewery journey there, too. Yeah. And now you're you're seven years old as a business. Um, and give us give us an idea of what things are like now.

So we got the we started from the homebrew opened up our doors. Where's Virginia beer at? Now,

[00:06:54] Chris Smith: yeah, it's almost it's been 7 years, like you said, so it's almost hard to remember back to those early days and how it was. I think on day 7. Uh, people on our team, you know, our, we had hired, we were smart if we were homebrewers, like Robbie said, but we were smart enough to hire a professional brewer to run our brew houses before we opened.

He was the only production employees, the 2 of us and maybe 4 other people. I think, um, so small team, you know, doing everything together all the time. Uh, and now, um, things have changed quite a bit. We have 22 people on our team, um, a full production team, a full sales team, full taproom team, management team as well.

Um, we sell beer across the entire Commonwealth of Virginia in New York City. Uh, and we export beer as well, um, to five different markets at the moment. Um, so things have certainly changed a lot, um, since 2016. And the operation is more complex, uh, more challenging, but also more rewarding, especially with the number of people that we get to work with and the number of organizations that we can positively impact

in

[00:07:56] Chris: our area.

That's fantastic. Congratulations on the success so far, guys. Um, it's no small feat, especially after the couple of years that we've just had. Um, it's a very tough time for any business. Uh, you know, I've talked to many breweries that started just before. That happened, um, because it was a booming time. And then bam, here's, here's the pandemic.

You guys obviously started well before that, but still had to weather it. Um, is there anything that sticks out to you or you could speak on that is like, uh, maybe a key takeaway or a lesson that you now know and have learned after seven years that you wish you knew when you started, um, and you're just like, man, I wish I would have known that when we, when we opened the

[00:08:39] Robby: doors back then.

I mean, I, I, it might sound kind of cliche, but for me, it's kind of expect the unexpected, which, which is just one of those, like, you know, and every time, um, you know, when jokes about starting a small business, being a small business owner, leaving corporate America behind, there's always that, like, oh, you know, you make the joke about, like, I'm leaving my 10 hour a day job behind to start my own company where I can work 20 hours a day, you know, and, and, um, that said, I think the enjoyment factor more than makes up for many of the trials and tribulations we've gone through, especially since we've had some success and we're able to weather.

Yeah. The storm of the pandemic, but certainly in 2016, did we have S. O. P. S. in place for a pandemic that we have S. O. P. S. in place to how to shift our growing sales team during the pandemic to ensure that they still had things to do so that we can keep them employed when they couldn't be out in the market and hosting festivals and selling into bars and restaurants like we didn't have any S.

O. P. S. for any of that. And so obviously that's an extreme situation. But I think now, seven years in, it's like, as we're looking forward, it's like, let's plan for as many inevitabilities as possible because we don't know exactly which way things are going to go. You know, we don't know, um, when draft is going to be up and package is going to be down or when bottles are going to be in, in, um, in boat versus cans.

Um, you know, we don't know when. Food trucks are in and brew pubs are down, you know, like there's just so many things that we have to think about. And so we need to have these broader conversations. And now that we've grown, we've got this brain trust, you know, our brew master has been with us since before day 1.

Our operations manager has been with us since before day 1. Our sales director has been with us since before day 1. So we've got this, this brain trust and this longevity and this trust now across the upper management team. And I think it's like, Hey, let's, let's throw everything at the wall and have conversations that hopefully hopefully Check as many boxes as possible, because we never know what, what we need to be prepared for in the coming months and years.

Yeah, what,

[00:10:21] Chris: like a gauntlet of something like that to go through that forces you to think outside the box and pushes you to, to be better. Ultimately, it sounds like you guys have done that. And I love what you said about keeping folks employed during that time, but you still have to run a business. So how do we do that in a way that.

Benefits everybody and keeps us safe and so on and so forth. So excellent. Uh, excellent bit of advice. It would have been great to have the crystal ball to know what the future holds, you know, but it just doesn't work like that. Um,

[00:10:50] Robby: I will say that, like, you know, for us, it's like the crystal ball wasn't there, but like, you know, we had some serendipity.

We just, we just installed a canning line right now. It's like we hadn't, we didn't have that canning line. Um, things have been different and I, you know, we look at breweries that maybe didn't have the canning or bottling lines in place to be able to package beer and shift those draft splits to package and the access to the aluminum or glass.

I mean, um, you know, we didn't do that because we were planning for a pandemic, but because of that planning of growth and economies of scale that put us in a position to succeed during the pandemic. So, um, you know, again, it goes to that, like, big picture thinking and trying to trying to be ahead of what the next challenge is going to be.

Yeah.

[00:11:24] Chris: What a, what a great happenstance to have the canning line there. That would have been a total different story without it. Um, and yeah, man, serendipity for sure, but in a very, very good way, happy accidents happen sometimes too. Um, you know, on a more intentional note, you guys have recently gone through a rebranding, done some freshening up on the brand and that kind of thing.

What, what led you to want to do that? What was the motivation behind wanting to make the change or the update?

[00:11:52] Chris Smith: I think, uh, well, so, you know, we started in 2016 and, and we had, uh, our brand built out and designed and we actually fairly quickly started releasing beer and cans. I think it was October of 2016.

We opened in March of 2016. Um, so those can designs were done pretty early on and we tweaked them, I think, in 2018, but as you know, um, so much changed in the craft beer industry between 2014, 15, 16, when we were developing our initial branding. And 2020 2021 2022, um, so many new entrance, different angles, different looks, different takes on on craft beer.

And, you know, we're active. Our brand is very active in grocery stores, convenience stores, you know, as well as in our taproom and independent bottle shops and bars. So, the look that we had in 2016 was great for that time. But I think, you know, by the time we got to this refresh was like, wow, we are.

Overdue on a refresh. This isn't kind of like keeping up with consumer tastes with with modern looks. Um, and we just we were I think we were actually overdue to take a look at our branding and and freshen it up and make it pop a little bit more.

[00:13:02] Chris: Yeah, you got to say, got to stay on the beat. I mean, it looks fantastic.

It's very fresh looking. Um, whoever did the work on it did a great job. And I guess that's a good question for you guys. Did you do this internally with an internal team or did you guys outsource for

[00:13:16] Robby: the, for the rebranding? So we actually, we've got a, we have a graphic designer with whom we've worked, uh, since before the brewery opened and, uh, our brand has matured a lot, you know, but both before we met him, we had some ideas about how we wanted the, the overall brewery logo and brand to look.

And he really helped us flush that out. Um, but, and then internally though, uh, because we've got this brand trust, you know, there's a lot of kind of ideas that, that gel together. We we've got the fortune to have a lot of, um, back and forth conversation, even if it's not. Specific set meetings that kind of puts ideas in our heads and we let them marinate and then they come together.

So, um, 1 of those folks are operations manager in particular is very adept at working with, you know, pick monkey and Photoshop. And so helping us kind of bring things to life before we before enduring the conversations with our graphic designers. So we can try to. Make sure that we're all kind of meeting halfway.

So our graphic designer deserves a lot of credit for thinking outside of his normal box and shooting us a ton of different options that many of which, to be honest with you, the way that we thought we were going to go is not where we landed, like where we landed was almost an afterthought in the beginning phases, but because we were able to visually talk about it as a group and put some things on paper and then send it back to him.

Um, the group conversation led to where we are now. So a good, a good team effort there. And again, it goes longevity and having someone who's been working with us for over seven years now, he kind of gets the way we think we get the way he thinks, and that helps to mature the brand. And usually in a conversation that, that we can all come to terms with sooner than later.

[00:14:41] Chris: Man, that's, it's interesting. You guys went that route and you had the ability to, you know, a lot of times we think about rebrand and an agency gets involved, you bring someone third party in, they take you through a branding process. We, we do this too, you know, we'll ask questions about, you know, what do you want to see?

What's your vision? What, what is valuable? What is the, you know, uh, what are the missions of the company and all these things to try to create something that is representative of your ideals, but also is, Um, but you guys have done that internally. Uh, and did you, did you like that process? Would you, would you recommend that?

It's just, if somebody is able to go through that, um, from now that you've experienced it,

[00:15:22] Chris Smith: I think, I think there are benefits and drawbacks certainly. Um, probably took us longer. Uh, doing it internally, just because we didn't have that, you know, assist from an agency kind of pushing the process along. I think we did have a somewhat clear idea in terms of when we get to like, packaging the things that we really wanted on our packaging and the things that we did not want on our packaging anymore.

That was pretty clear to us. So I think that helped. You know, being knowing all that helped us keep it an internal project. Um, and we love where we landed, of course, but I think, obviously, there are benefits to an agency and new eyes and fresh eyes. But but, like, Robbie said, we, I think, initially, we envision this being.

Another kind of refresh of the existing stuff and while we can elements of the existing packaging, it really is totally different and. It was a light bulb moment for us. I think when we saw that concept, which like Robbie said, it was kind of a throwaway, like, and here's another option. We're like, well, look at that, you know, that takes a lot of boxes that changes how a consumer is going to view us.

It's going to pick up new consumers. Hopefully we'll be able to retain our current consumers. Um, so, yeah, I think it was. It was all kind of lucky. And I do think without an agency, it could have gone the other way. Um, in some ways, again, um,

[00:16:41] Chris: a bit lucky. No, yeah, it's, it can't, you can make it work and you guys have clearly done that.

Um, you know, so props to, to your, your brain trust and your, your designers, cause it does look truly, uh, very nice. You know, this is stuff that. Seeing a lot of brands that are out there and looking at stuff all the time. It's like, wow, this is nice and very well thought through. Uh, so congratulations to that again.

Um, what's the response been like since you've done this, you know, when you, cause I guess to frame this a little bit more, I think one of the worries you have with it, of rebrand is you don't want to deter people that. Yeah. We're in love with the brand before and that you run that risk. Cause all of a sudden it's like, Oh, it's a new thing.

I don't like it anymore. Or I don't recognize it. What has the response been like since then? Are, are the folks that are folks are old folks digging it? Are new folks digging it? What was your guys vibe so far?

[00:17:31] Robby: I mean, the most important thing is that the pull rate so far has been has been up, right? So we've seen sales increase in markets, and we're getting we're getting more shelf places right now.

That's that's part of growth to from a business side, having a broader sales department. That's that's in part, you know, data driven, you know, being able to actually get in front of some of these buyers. And that was the whole point, getting this this fresh, clean look, um, to kind of cut through the noise and knowing that we were hopefully going to get some more shelf space across the state.

So that, that pull rate has definitely been up. Overall, people's feedback has been really positive in the tap room. We've got our, what we call our full time friends social club. It's our mug club. We call it the social club. And it's, you know, upwards of 300 people who, who pay to be a part of this, um, this, uh, VIP group.

And, and they obviously feel a lot of ownership of the brewery, which we love. And so, you know, we, we certainly heard some griping from them early on, you know, there, there, there was kind of a billboard effect of the early. Can designs a huge Virginia Berry company logo, you know, right in front. Um, and, and they, they were kind of missing that, you know, they, Oh, I, I buy the blue can, right.

And that's our bestselling IPA free verse. I buy the blue can. And we had some folks reach out and say, I can't find that blue can anymore. And so instantly for us, you know, that, that's a, that, that was a problem, not, not with the change in design, but the fact that people were just referencing the blue can or the red can, and not by the brand name and not by the style.

So there's an educational component to that. And I think we're still working on that a bit to kind of get the. Get the, um, the billboard effect out there that like, Hey, the liquid that, you know, in love is still here. It's just in a newer, fresher look and feel, and hopefully people stop thinking of it as the blue can start thinking of it as the hazy IPA or as free verse.

Um, and so generally speaking for, for any gripes we've had, we've seen pull rates up. We've seen overall feedback be very positive. And we certainly haven't lost any of our full time friends, social clubs so far. We'll see what 2024 renewal numbers look like. But so far, we're still getting the same foot traffic in the taproom that we were before.

[00:19:20] Chris: Good, good, good. It's, it's so funny how that stuff is with people. We just don't think about it unless you're into marketing and branding and reading all the books, which I'm a nerd about that stuff, but something as simple as like, oh yeah, I just had this blue can that I always went for. And in my mind, like you've got this little mental shortcut and it's safe and consistent in your mind.

And that's what brand trust is ultimately. As soon as you change that, it's like, it's exactly the same product. It's the same thing that you fall in love with just a little bit different look. All of a sudden that. Um, change. People are resistant to change. It's a very weird thing to go through but time will tell ultimately and it sounds like things are headed in the right track for you on that front.

Um so change of gears a little bit. Talk about blue cans. Let's keep talking about cans but uh you guys now have a 19 and a half ounce can. Am I understanding that correctly? So the new thing, why go, why go? I know there's some big brands that do this like the Voodoo Ranger stuff. They have these big cans.

What's the, what's the thought behind wanting to have Bad. And, uh, what has it been so far? What's what's the take on that? Yeah, we I think

[00:20:25] Chris Smith: we saw a gap in the market. Like you said, the kind of major national brands have been in that can size for a long time, and they fully dominate the convenience store market with those.

And but we saw what was happening is that they're doing well in convenience stores, but also Transcripts Moving into grocery stores, they were taking a lot of shelf space there and the numbers were really, really good. So, obviously, there's a consumer demand for that single serve size. Most of them are very high kind of 9% plus, but we saw an opportunity to try as a, as a 1st mover as a local brand, but also with the lower.

So free verse that blue can that IPA. 6. 8% we put that in the single serving size it, you know, in terms of, we kind of talked it through like, oh, this is a big deal. And then when we got down to it, it's like, oh, no, our canning line can actually do this with a 200 dollars of parts, you know, and some design work on the can and off we go.

Not too big a deal sourcing the cardboard boxes. Was that actually the hardest part? Yeah. So, so I think we're kind of a first mover in that space and that was an easier sell than, Hey, here are 30 brands that do this, but we do it too. Um, you know, this is the first Virginia IPA in this can size and it's been a nice addition, kind of a new adventure for us and, but it's, but it's done well for us

[00:21:43] Chris: so far.

Yeah, thank you for doing it. You know, every time I, uh, am out or there's certain scenarios that where you want that single serve can and, um, you know, here in Las Vegas, you were out on the strip sometimes. And, uh, that's what's there is, you know, before it was like, Oh, you had to go and get like a big old core slide or something like that.

If you wanted a beer down there now, they've got the super high ABV stuff and they're like, okay, but what I want is something that is super tasty is local. That would be the best thing I would want out there. So speaking from a Okay. Put my consumer hat on. That's awesome. If I saw something like that in the convenience store, hopefully your audience is seeing it that way too.

And going, yeah, I'd rather have that. And it's perfect for what I want right on, right on. So, um, you got some other stuff going on. Let's talk about the new flagship, the gorgeous Citra IPA. How's that going since you guys have launched that recently? Is that going well for you?

[00:22:35] Robby: Yeah, it's great. It's funny, too, because we kind of internally rolled our eyes a little bit because we were like, all right, our big innovation for 2023 is going to be, wait for it, another IPA.

It wasn't exactly groundbreaking, and we all had that pause moment where we were like, is this really what we're doing? We're hanging our hats on this, but it checks a lot of boxes for us. Hey, the liquid's amazing. So like, um, we had, we've got a five barrel system and a 30 barrel system. So we, we brew a lot of small batches that only hit the tapper and taps, right?

They don't go out for distribution. They don't get sent out for bars and restaurants. But we, we use that as a test case, right? So the people come into the tap room, they'll let us know what they like. And we hear from people like, oh, I really, I miss this beer. When is this beer coming back? And so gorgeous as a small 5 barrel test batch, lower alcohol IPA 5.

7%, not quite a session IPA, but just just over kind of what you'd consider for a pale ale. So it's right there. The beginning of an IPA, uh, and it's 100% citric hops, so it's super juicy, super citrusy, just a mild haze. Um, so it kind of checks all those boxes. It's really sessionable. Our best selling IPA, Freeverse, a little more punch to it, 6.

8%. It's got Chinook and Azacca. It's got kind of a East Coast, West Coast fusion thing going, but, um, you know, our sales director always jokes, you know, if you've had a Freeverse or two, the difference with Gorgeous is it's much softer on the palate. It doesn't, it doesn't have that same hit. And so it really was differentiating itself and it was asked after a ton.

So we started brewing 10 barrel batches of it. And then all of a sudden it was 30 barrel batches. And we sent like one little, you know, test batch out to market and it did really well. And so all of a sudden we were like, look, this beer is, I'm checking a box that Freebris isn't, uh, IPAs are still pulling state statewide, countrywide, uh, adding a second IPA to the rotation, especially a lower alcohol one, a slightly more sessionable one with a completely different flavor and aroma palette than our flagship IPA, just it checked a ton of boxes.

And. With the brand refresh going on, the other thing it did for us was it added a 16 ounce can component because all of our core brands Freeverse, Saving Daylight, which is a citrus, Wheat Ale, and then Elbow Patches, which is a oatmeal stout, to go along with our Hazy IPA. Freeverse are all 12 ounce cans, so six packs of 12 ounce cans, 12 packs of Freeverse as well.

Obviously now 19, two cans of free verse, but we didn't have a 16 ounce can offering that was regularly available. All of our 16 ounce cans are always small batch or seasonal beers. So it checked a number of boxes for us. Um, and it's got like a fun ring to it. It's so much fun branding. We can play with, you know, like, hello, gorgeous.

You are what you drink. There's so many things we can do with that beer. Um, and it's, and it's really worked out well. It hasn't so far. It has not, um, Been vampiric at all, hasn't stolen free verse taps or free risk shelf space. Uh, and if anything, it's kind of grown our, our four, four core brands together because, you know, that fourth beer has always been the laggard and doesn't mean it wasn't a good beer, just having four courses always going to be a number four and we've, we've struggled with how to, how to bring the number four up closer to what one and three, one through three are doing.

And so bar gorgeous is pulling itself up where it's probably going to surpass, you know, at some point two and three, um, if not one of the features, and that's gonna be a great problem to have. Yeah, yeah, great

[00:25:38] Chris: problem to have. And, uh, you're, you're obviously conscious of it being vampiric to the other ones too, but it sounds like it's fit a hole and kind of stood on it out on its own.

And I like what you said about Letting the, um, letting your, your customers kind of drive the decision behind ramping that up. And you hear a lot about national trends and research data and like what people, what, what some people say other people are thinking when it comes to beer tastes. You know, I think the, the ones that are popular right now are more of a, the lean towards the loggers and the Pilseners and that craft section.

And, you know, I think there's. A natural tendency to kind of want to follow those trends and say, yeah, we need to do that because that's what, that's what the research people are saying is what the podcasts are saying. But in your guys case, you've let sales and internal feedback help drive that. Um, on that, do you buy into.

Kind of some of these, these national trends that we see with, uh, you know, like the super boozy and the N. A. beer and the, and the sours going away and like all this stuff that we keep hearing about. Do you guys buy into that kind of thing or are you out on your own doing your own thing? No, we've

[00:26:45] Chris Smith: certainly become a more data driven brewery over the past couple of years.

We use IRI data quite a bit. So we, we know and understand what the trends are. I think that's important. I think just Operating the business based on those trends is kind of problematic. Um, so we take them into account into when we're making decisions about our portfolio and future innovation, but I don't think they fully guide us.

You know, they're kind of a piece of the puzzle and another piece is. The taproom feedback that we get, but also we need to remember that that taproom crowd is not. The grocery store consumer, you know, that's a very different consumer. So we're going to put all these different. Yeah, we put all these things together and we try to synthesize them and come up with.

You know, products and innovations that that do make sense for the market, but are still going to. You know, work in the tavern. This is there's so many considerations when we're when we're thinking about future

[00:27:38] Chris: products and you got that brain trust. You got a group of folks that are capable of brainstorming and thinking about thinking around corners.

Really, when it comes to this, I like what you said to take the take the information to, uh, you know, into factor it into the decision. But, you know, ultimately, you got to let your data drive a lot of those decisions to which is a smart, smart move as well. Same with marketing. We coach the same stuff. It's like, well, you know, There's there's what people say and when you should post and how you should post and once you should run ads, but ultimately your data is going to lead you in the right direction as to what works, when it works, so on and so forth.

So vibe with you on that one. Um, I want to change direction a little bit and, uh, kind of move to some of the last stuff I want to ask you guys about. And I promise I'll get you back to your, your busy schedules, but I want to ask about the charity stuff you guys do. You guys do a lot of partnerships with nonprofits, charitable organizations.

Why is it so important for you and your brand to, to do good? Stuff.

[00:28:36] Robby: Yeah, and I think it goes back to the, uh, the, the O. G. days when we were talking about opening up a rewrite. I mean, for us, what drew us back to Williamsburg was not just our affinity for the college and wanting to have a couple trips together here and there after we graduated, but we were on a volunteer board for William and Mary, which was focused on getting alums involved in the college community after they had left Williamsburg.

Right? So how do you get them? To give time and treasure as the college would say. So whether it's volunteer, whether it's donations, just stay engaged in the community, support the students and help the college, um, you know, do what it's trying to do. And that's better the world through education. And so that's that was a starting point for us.

And then going to all these breweries and craft beer bars and seeing all the camaraderie. And seeing all the philanthropy that all these breweries and, um, beer bars were involved with, you know, it felt like, well, this is this is something we're passionate about. Right? We're passionate about doing it fully.

Mary. We're passionate about this industry. It seems to be doing it naturally. The idea of a local, right? Like a spot that you can hang out of that just by drinking a beer, you could do good. Um, you know, the idea of being a force for good in the form of a brewery was was at the foundation of the business plan.

So, you know, our company mantra is beer people purpose with the idea that all three of those boxes should be checked with anything that we do that that makes an impact on the business and on our community. And as we grow, the community becomes more than just Williamsburg. It becomes the state of Virginia.

We have export business now becomes a global thing. I mean, everything is linked. And so. Um, you know, sometimes it's local organizations, but we've tried to say that it goes beyond just slapping a nonprofit's name on a beer and saying, we're going to donate 10 per barrel back. That's part of it, but it's also hosting pop up events, giving these nonprofits and these organizations a platform to get in front of folks who might otherwise just be enjoying a beer.

And maybe they learn something or hear something and they get involved in their own time. But then it also goes beyond that. And we've tried to really encourage not just ourselves, but our team to get involved in their personal lives as well. So I know for Chris and I were both on a number of boards for nonprofits where we've actually met the people who run these organizations and we fall in love with their their passion and what they try to do for the community.

And so we have joined these various boards to try to be impactful beyond what the brewery can do as an organization. We've encouraged our staff to do the same thing. And the hope is that if we if we just show that we can show them that we can Showcase what the brewery is all about by doing it ourselves.

Hopefully then the rest of the brewery and the rest of the community kind of follows and starts to make their own positive impact around us. So it's definitely at the core of the business. It started at William Mary and it's grown, you know, numerously since then. Yeah, you

[00:31:00] Chris: know, uh, I think it's when we think about branding and, you know, associating with charities and stuff like that.

I think there's there's a way to do it in authentically where you just like, yeah, I can't something washing right? Like you're kind of like charity washing or whatever to try to make your brand look like it cares. Um, but In order to sell more products, ultimately, and people see through that stuff. And I think the solution is to be about it as well, not just to talk about it, but be about it.

And you guys are clearly doing that with everything. I didn't know you guys were on these boards and things like that. So, uh, you guys are clearly walking the walk and

[00:31:35] Robby: talking to talk.

[00:31:37] Chris Smith: Yeah, authenticity has been such a big part of our business, you know, since we opened. We, you know, Rob and I actually, when we decided we wanted to do this, we looked at other locations that were not Williamsburg, Virginia.

One of the many reasons that it fell to being here is it's authentic. You know, we met here, we have a story here, we have, we're in this community. Whereas if we just go to, I don't know, pick a, pick somewhere else, somewhere in Georgia or South Carolina, you know, when people ask us, well, why are you here?

Our, our answer would be, uh, to make some money, you know, which is just not. why we're in this business. Obviously, that's nice. But, um, we're in it for authentic reasons, and we really do care. And I totally agree, there are brands, unfortunately, that, um, Are involved in charity just to, to say they are. Um, that's not why we want to be involved with our local nonprofit

[00:32:27] Chris: partners.

No, that's great. That's great. Guys, there's so many good takeaways from this conversation about branding and business growth. And, uh, I'm very happy that you're sure that stuff with me, is there anything else that you guys would like to, to bring up or talk about? Uh, you know, here's the platform for you.

What do you got going on? What can people get involved with? Tell

[00:32:46] Robby: us. Yeah, I mean, I think for us, you know, it's just kind of, um, you know, hoping that that folks find the beers and the concepts and the philanthropy interesting. Um, and, you know, and it's, I think, just just like where we got our start, we would encourage folks to try something new, right?

You know, if you haven't tried craft beer, you know, it is just Try something go to a bar and ask for a splash. Um, if, if you love, you know, just, just one beer from a specific brewery, try, try their, their second beer, because you might fall in love with that second beer. And it's all about experimentation and variety.

And I think that's, that's the fun we're having is that it's about, yeah, what, what that fourth year round beer is going to be, but it's also about, you know, that, that small batch beer that's going to be in the tap room that hopefully you. Yeah. Become someone's favorite beer, and then that's the beer they started asking about every time they business it and that that might actually have a butterfly effect and impact a business in a way that, that all of a sudden, that business might be two years down the road, adds that to the rotation.

You know? And so with the craft beer consumer, uh, our regulars, our full-time friends, you know, they have such a big impact on what we do. And even if they don't see it on a daily basis over the course of time, it has a huge impact on, on. Just the future of the business. And I think we've got high expectations for being a statewide brewery now for the first time, um, having a new flagship brand, having a new identity with our core branding, uh, really trying to lean into, you know, being Virginia's beer company and, and really owning that name and, and, and really celebrating not just the Williamsburg community, but the entire state of Virginia and, you know, en masse, the craft beer industry.

So, um, hopefully even in tough times, people still see the, the enthusiasm and the excitement of craft beer, because that's why we got into it. And that's, that's, yeah. So what we're trying to push out there is that, you know, it's a positive, fun, engaging, community focused industry. And we don't want to lose sight of that no matter how big we grow, how far and wide we distribute.

[00:34:27] Chris: That's fantastic. Man, you can tell too, you know, if you're listening to this and you want to see it, go check out the Instagram. You know, it's a great example of a rebranding that's working. If you're in the Virginia area or in the areas that we just talked about where you guys are selling, look for the Virginia Beer Co.

on the shelves in those pretty new cans. And enjoy some of that product and send them some messages about it, too. I'm sure you guys like that on IG or whatever. So definitely encourage folks to do that. And I'll be up, uh, hopefully I'm up in the area. I'll find some myself and get some of that. So thank you guys again for the time and sharing the insights with us.

I really, really appreciate it. And hopefully we can do this again sometime in the future.

[00:35:05] Robby: Sounds great. Thanks for hosting us. Yeah. Thanks,

[00:35:07] Chris: Chris. Yeah, of course.